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Urgent Warning to Mac Users
Old 05-12-2005, 10:39 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Please note that the new release of the Mac OS, 10.4 (aka "Tiger,") is NOT COMPATIBLE with Norton software, including AntiVirus and System Utilities. There is a large probability that you will seriously mess up your computer if you try to install Norton software in 10.4. I have spent the past hour on the phone with a user over this issue and I don't know that we'll be able to resolve it without me having to go out there. (Argh!)

M
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Re: Urgent Warning to Mac Users
Old 05-12-2005, 12:42 PM   #2 (permalink)
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thx for the update

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Re: Urgent Warning to Mac Users
Old 05-12-2005, 03:35 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Thanx for the warning, BUT

Why are you running Norton antivirus on a computer that has no known viruses?

If I had a dime for every Mac Ive had to fix, that was a direct result of NORTON and their garbage software screwing something up, under the guise of "protecting" the system, I would be a rich man.

You dont need antivirus software for OSX.

As for keeping your Mac in good running order, run a permissions repair once a month, or after installing software. Run Disk Utility once a month. If you run into a problem that disk utility wont fix, I strongly recomend Disk Warrior. Its worked great several times for me in the last 3 years.

But as for "NORTON" and thier garbage products, do yourself a huge favor and toss them in the waste bin where they belong. At one point they were usefull. That ended with OSX. I promise you that they will cause more problems "maintaining" and "optimizing" your Mac than they will ever solve.

What kind of company sells an antivirus product for an operating system that has (to date) no known viruses?



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In My Defense
Old 05-12-2005, 04:02 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I'm not running it, nor do I run any Norton products. The user I mentioned is my boss's father (who also founded our company) and some snot at CompUSA sold him 10.4 (Tiger) yesterday and then told him he'd need "a good antivirus program," and sold him NAV to go with it. I personally would have told him to fold his "good antivirus program" until it was all corners and then do something anatomically improbable with it, but I wasn't there. I somehow never seem to become involved until it's too late.

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Re: Urgent Warning to Mac Users
Old 05-12-2005, 05:24 PM   #5 (permalink)
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[ QUOTE ]
Why are you running Norton antivirus on a computer that has no known viruses?


[/ QUOTE ]

I suspect that there are viruses for the MAC. If there were not, then there would be no anti-virus programs for the Mac. To write such a program you have to have a least one virus to check it with. In addition to Norton there are other anti-virus programs for MAC.

Also keep in mind that it is not so much macro viruses that are the problem on MAC but trojans and backdoors. Products like Norton's watch for those sorts of things also.

But I'm fair minded. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] You state there are no known viruses, so I simply ask you to post links to those sites that show there are none along with their discussion of how they proved it.

Cheers,
rfs
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Re: Urgent Warning to Mac Users
Old 05-13-2005, 12:35 AM   #6 (permalink)
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[ QUOTE ]
Thanx for the warning, BUT

Why are you running Norton antivirus on a computer that has no known viruses?

If I had a dime for every Mac Ive had to fix, that was a direct result of NORTON and their garbage software screwing something up, under the guise of "protecting" the system, I would be a rich man.

You dont need antivirus software for OSX.

As for keeping your Mac in good running order, run a permissions repair once a month, or after installing software. Run Disk Utility once a month. If you run into a problem that disk utility wont fix, I strongly recomend Disk Warrior. Its worked great several times for me in the last 3 years.

But as for "NORTON" and thier garbage products, do yourself a huge favor and toss them in the waste bin where they belong. At one point they were usefull. That ended with OSX. I promise you that they will cause more problems "maintaining" and "optimizing" your Mac than they will ever solve.

What kind of company sells an antivirus product for an operating system that has (to date) no known viruses?

[/ QUOTE ]

No Mac Viruses???

Ok, so what is this?

Destructive OS X malware spies on Apple users

Sounds to me like it's a virus.. and after googling for MAC Viruses, I see alot more...


Andrew
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Re: Urgent Warning to Mac Users
Old 05-13-2005, 01:06 AM   #7 (permalink)
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why are you running Norton antivirus on a computer that has no known viruses?


[/ QUOTE ]

I suspect that there are viruses for the MAC. If there were not, then there would be no anti-virus programs for the Mac. To write such a program you have to have a least one virus to check it with. In addition to Norton there are other anti-virus programs for MAC.

Also keep in mind that it is not so much macro viruses that are the problem on MAC but trojans and backdoors. Products like Norton's watch for those sorts of things also.


But I'm fair minded. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] You state there are no known viruses, so I simply ask you to post links to those sites that show there are none along with their discussion of how they proved it.

Cheers,
rfs

[/ QUOTE ]


Fredrick,

Im sorry, but you suspect wrong. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

However, please note that I said that there are no viruses for Mac OSX. NOT for Mac. There is a difference. There WERE some viruses on the Mac from from OS versions 4 thru 9.2.2. I believe the sum total off all those (over a 10 year history) was less than 100 total. In other words, there were fewer Viruses on the Macintosh EVER, than appear within a WEEK on Windows. A goodly chunk of those, I might add, were MS Word Macro Viruses (thanks Bill)

As for OSX, which has been the Mac OS for several years now, there are NO viruses, NO trojans, and NO worms. Period. As for me "proving" it to you? I suggest the opposite. You show me ONE confirmed, active, in the loose virus that INFECTS and AFFECTS Mac OSX.

Why then, are they anti virus programs for the Mac?

1. people are dumb enough to buy them

2. they CAN filter out PC viruses that may reside on your Mac (via email etc) that can be passed along to PC users. The Mac cannot be infected by a PC virus, but it could pass it along via email.

There are still companies that will sell you a screen saver for your LCD panel as well. (LCD screens CANNOT suffer permanent burn in)

Can a Mac OSX virus be written? Never say never. Some people will discount the lack of any on the fact that the Mac has much smaller Market share than the PC, and virus authors want to cause as much havoc as possible, so they dont bother with the Mac.

I say BS.

They dont exist because nobody has been able to do it. And you can bet there are those trying. Think of it this way. If you were some punk virus author, what would gain you notoriety, writing yet another Windows virus, which apparently just about any moron can do, or cracking the holy grail of a platform that has NO viruses?

Or lets look at numbers. The Mac has about 4-5 percent market share compared to Windows. But lets say it only has ONE percent market share. Would it not have 1 percent as many viruses? There are over 12000 viruses on PCs, where are the 120 on the Mac?

Anyway, Im not going to turn this into a platform war. Ill close by saying that viruses are NOT a "normal" part of computing. ONLY if you are using a Microsoft OS. You wont see them running rampant on Mac OSX, Linux, Solaris, or any of the dozens of other UNIX based computer operating system. Nor did you see it on the Mac BEFORE OSX, when the Mac was NOT based on unix.

Only on Windows folks. Because its the most insecure operating system out there. Plain and simple.

Further reading:

http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,63000,00.html

http://ptech.wsj.com/archive/ptech-20031023.html

Note the quote about 3 paragraphs in on that one:

"Mac OS X hasn't had any viruses since the OS was launched," says Bill Rosenkrantz, the head of Macintosh products at Symantec, the big antivirus firm. "It's more difficult to attack the Apple system than Windows."

Admited right there by the head of Symantec. Yet they will still SELL you the cure for a non-existant problem.


http://aroundcny.com/technofile/texts/mac040605.html


http://www.baltimoresun.com/technolo.../bal-mac082803,0,1353478.column

That one is really good. If you read it in depth it will explain the major reasons why Mac OSX does not have the virus problems Windows does.


http://www.digitalmedievalist.com/it...ve/000203.html

http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/security/

http://www.applelinks.com/p5/index.p...x_virus_claim/

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Re: Urgent Warning to Mac Users
Old 05-13-2005, 01:18 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Andrew,

Read further than the headlines.

"Opener is not a virus, Trojan horse, or worm," Apple said in a statement. "It does not propagate itself across a network, through email, or over the Web. Opener can only be installed by someone who already has access to your system and provides proper administrator authentication. Apple advises users to only install software from vendors and Web sites that they know and trust."

From another source:

There is a rumor going through the Internet that a 'virus' has finally been written for Mac OS X. This is (partially) false. There is a UNIX script, called 'Opener', that is able to do some hefty modifications to your Mac. BUT, it is not a virus. From a discussion on Apple.com:

"Opener is a "rootkit," or a set of software tools that intruders can use to gain access to a computer; it's installed either through a known vulnerability or password-cracking. Rootkits don't spread on their own, as viruses do, and require administrator access to be installed.

As also mentioned in the article, it's not a virus since it can't self replicate. Rather, it's another attempt at a Trojan, like the fake MS Word trial installer that was a script that deleted your home folder. As I highlighted in red, it can't do anything until the user allows it by saying OK when the admin dialogue pops up. Anyone who clicks OK without even knowing why they are clicking OK kind of gets what they deserve."

Basically, to allow this 'malware' (the technical term for what Opener really is) to do anything to your computer, you would have to (a) download or recieve an installer/program that has Opener attached to it, and then (b) install it and type in your username and password when a dialog box pops up asking you to do so.

Viruses can replicate and install themselves - Opener cannot do this, so it is not called a virus... it is called 'Malware' --> a software program that can only do damage to your computer if you actively let it.



Lets see, a program that has to be MANUALLY and INTENTIONALLY installed by a user with proper authentication?

Yup, and if I intentionally and knowingly bash my Mac with a hammer, it will quit working. Should I call that a virus?

C:/format - is that a virus?



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I disagree..
Old 05-13-2005, 01:32 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Let's just say that I, like others, disagree with your points and also with your attempts (in my view) to start a flame war. So I'll just drop out of this conversation.
Cheers,
rfs
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Re: I disagree..
Old 05-13-2005, 01:38 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Why is it that every time something gets posted about a Mac, its "an attempt to start a flame war"

You asked a question, I answered. You wanted examples, I gave them.

But because you seemingly refuse to accept that fact that what I am saying is true, (backed up with exactly what you asked for) you accuse me of trying to start a flame war.

Disagree all you want. Makes no difference to me. I simply gave you EXACTLY what YOU asked me to. Just one thing, did you actually READ any of the links YOU asked me to provide to you?





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