Lens Diaries Go Now
Glamour, Beauty, Nude, Models, Photographers

*    |  Register  


 
Go Back   Garage Glamour™ > Garage Glamour™ Main Forums > Tech Talk Forum
 

Tech Talk Forum Photography & Technical Related Only!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Nikon D70 and frame counter
Old 06-26-2004, 01:21 AM   #1 (permalink)
Lifetime Photographer
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Member GG#: 35977
Posts: 609
Comments: 0

Andy_Pearlman is offline IP: 24.130.241.138
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Anyone out there with a D70 understand the crazy frame counter on this camera? In JPG mode it seems accurate, but in RAW mode its WAY off, and the manual seems to acknowledge this, but with no explanation. For example, according to the manual, a 256mb CF card can hold 44 images at 5mb - which if you do the math, sort of makes sense. But, it also says the "exposures remaining" counter will show 23. (I'm using 1gb & 512mb cards, and the numbers increase respectively). There is no explanation for why it does this. I could understand some variance for file size, but this is so far off it makes it impossible to gauge how to plan for a new card.

Anyone have a clue? Jason? (and BTW, the cards came Thursday, thanks). And yes, my next email is to Nikon support.

Regards,
Andy Pearlman
Andy Pearlman Studio
  View Public Profile Send a private message to Andy_Pearlman Visit Andy_Pearlman's homepage! Find More Posts by Andy_Pearlman
 
Re: Nikon D70 and frame counter
Old 06-26-2004, 02:29 AM   #2 (permalink)
Lifetime Photographer

 
n5wd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Member GG#: 37369
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Posts: 636
Comments: 0

n5wd is offline IP: 68.113.203.221
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Andy,

I'm not shooting a D70, but rather a D100 - the RAW files on this 6 megabyte (3000x2000 - similar to the D70's 3008x2000) run about 9 megabytes in size (9.7-9.8 MB to be even more accurate), and with that I'm getting 51 images on a 512 MB card. That's in RAW, uncompressed. On a 256 MB card, I'd assume about half that, plus or minus one or two.

If I change it to RAW, compressed, though, the manual says I'd get a file size some 50-60% of the original RAW (55% of 9.7 MB = 5.3 MB ) file size. But, the manual also says "The number of expsures remaining shown in control and the viewfinder is the same as in the case of uncompressed NEF (RAW) images. The ACTUAL (my emphasis) number of images that can be stored on the memory card is higher than shown."

Is that what's happening to you, maybe? Are you storing them in RAW, compressed? The reason, as it was explained to me, it works this way is that the computer has no way of knowing just how much compression will be able to be applied until it tries on each image, therefore you can consider the counter a "worst case" number, with the actual images stored even more. Now, to me, that doesn't give me warm and fuzzy feelings, but that was the explanation from the Nikon rep I talked with.

Could this be what's happening on your D70?

Wayne

Wayne's web site
  View Public Profile Send a private message to n5wd Visit n5wd's homepage! Find More Posts by n5wd
 
Re: Nikon D70 and frame counter
Old 06-26-2004, 02:31 AM   #3 (permalink)
Free Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Member GG#: 36202
Posts: 9
Comments: 0

Jwallace is offline IP: 4.61.173.150
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Andy,

It might be a variance picture detail, ie a photo of a white wall does'nt take up a whole lot of memory where a photo of a tree with a lot of details in the leaves etc will take up a lot more memory.

Hope this makes sense,

Jon
  View Public Profile Send a private message to Jwallace Find More Posts by Jwallace
 
Re: Nikon D70 and frame counter
Old 06-26-2004, 03:04 AM   #4 (permalink)
Lifetime Photographer
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Member GG#: 35977
Posts: 609
Comments: 0

Andy_Pearlman is offline IP: 24.130.241.138
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Wayne - What you say makes sense (expecially your third paragraph about the variable file size depending on the image, although this seems like a LOT of variance). The only thing is, as far as I can tell from the controls and the manual, there is no option to compress the RAW files. My files are smaller than your 8-9mb, so maybe they are compressed, but it seems to me if they were going to give us only one choice, it would be to not compress. Maybe they found a new way to compress them so they didn't have to ask us to make a choice, but as I said, it still seems odd that the frame counter would be off almost by double. Let's see if anyone else has some ideas in the morning, I'm off to bed. Thanks!

Thanks,
Andy Pearlman
Andy Pearlman Studio
  View Public Profile Send a private message to Andy_Pearlman Visit Andy_Pearlman's homepage! Find More Posts by Andy_Pearlman
 
One other possibility
Old 06-26-2004, 06:33 AM   #5 (permalink)
King of Useless Facts
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Member GG#: 35691
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 499
Comments: 0
Send a message via AIM to StMarc

StMarc is offline IP: 169.207.244.175
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Have you tried formatting the card in the camera? Sometimes junk accumulates on the card in directories that don't get deleted for some reason, and even though you deleted the pics, the card still isn't empty.

I don't think this is your problem - it's probably something to do with a bad "guess" algorithm - but it's a possibility. I have a habit of changing directory names on the card before I download them to my computer, because they get copied twice. If I forget to erase the directory, and then tell the camera "delete all photos," it won't get the ones in that directory because it only deletes photos in directories with names that fit the camera's naming convention.

M
  View Public Profile Send a private message to StMarc Visit StMarc's homepage! Find More Posts by StMarc
 
Re: Nikon D70 and frame counter
Old 06-26-2004, 12:42 PM   #6 (permalink)
Free Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Member GG#: 35200
Location: Fairfield
Posts: 109
Comments: 0
My Mood:

bsphoto is offline IP: 134.53.145.142
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Looks like you have all the answers in the different threads, but I'll summarize.

1) The D-70 does not have an UNcompressed NEF (raw) file mode. It only compresses it.

2) The final file size of the NEF file is going to depend on how well it compresses. That's going to depend on how much detail is in the image and how much noise is in the image.

3) Becuase the file sizes are variable, there is no way for the camera to know how many exposures will fit on the card. The frame counter will show a conservative "guess".

4) This happens while shooting JPEG format all the time, but becuase the files are much smaller people either don't notice or don't complain. For example my S2 typically gets 224 pics per card, raither the the frame counters indicated 220. My Fuji 4900 did it too.
  View Public Profile Send a private message to bsphoto Visit bsphoto's homepage! Find More Posts by bsphoto
 
Re: Nikon D70 and frame counter
Old 06-26-2004, 01:08 PM   #7 (permalink)
Still Learning

 
Bonner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Member GG#: 36942
Location: Ventura
Posts: 568
Comments: 1
My Mood:

Bonner is offline IP: 64.165.228.44
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

I read that Nikon found a way to compress the RAW files on the D70. As a further note, my Nikon 8700 will show 104 images on the counter at "Fine" setting on a 256MB card. I often get 140 - 150 captures when it is full. I am sure you will soon learn this, and all the other "logics" of this camera.
How are the images?

Jim
  View Public Profile Send a private message to Bonner Visit Bonner's homepage! Find More Posts by Bonner
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Sponsors


New To Site? Need Help? Photographer & Model Links
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:35 PM.

© 1999-2017 Garage Glamour™




Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93