Lens Diaries Go Now
Glamour, Beauty, Nude, Models, Photographers

*    |  Register  


 
Go Back   Garage Glamour™ > Garage Glamour™ Main Forums > Main Community Forum
 

Main Community Forum General Modeling & Photography Forum
Adult posts prohibited!>>Please Read Our GUIDELINES before posting!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Kodak, Picture Kiosks, and Copyright
Old 12-19-2006, 01:47 AM   #1 (permalink)
Free Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Member GG#: 35737
Location: Foley
Posts: 180
Comments: 0

David Bunch is offline IP: 216.231.162.9
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

My full-time job is managing a 1-hr. photo lab for a major chain store. I recently attended a regional meeting during which a Kodak rep was touting the benefits of their newest kiosks, specifically the quality of the scanners and the accuracy of the software. The rep made SURE to remind all of us to remove any passwords which would limit the customer from completing the order themselves (previously in place to help prevent prank waste), and NOT to inspect any pictures being copied, or the actual copies made. It seems their legal dept. has determined that if the lab personnel are not aware that the customer is violating copyright, the lab is not liable - only the customer.

So Kodak actively produces and markets equipment which is capable of enabling consumers to violate copyright, but they also encourage lab personnel to turn a blind eye and do nothing to stop it. They prolly figured out that the main reason a person would want a photo copied is to copy a photo they didn't take in the first place.

The Moral? If you thought Kodak cared one whit about Pros you were naive, and if you're a Pro and you still depend on the print orders for the majority of your income, you better think seriously about shifting to a labor-based business type a.s.a.p.

David
  View Public Profile Send a private message to David Bunch Visit David Bunch's homepage! Find More Posts by David Bunch
 
Re: Kodak, Picture Kiosks, and Copyright
Old 12-19-2006, 02:32 AM   #2 (permalink)
J T Smith

 
jtsmith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Member GG#: 35390
Location: Pittsfield
Posts: 883
Comments: 0

jtsmith is offline IP: 12.25.247.217
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Bunch View Post

The Moral? If you thought Kodak cared one whit about Pros you were naive, and if you're a Pro and you still depend on the print orders for the majority of your income, you better think seriously about shifting to a labor-based business type a.s.a.p.

David
Kodak has always been interested in the consumer vs the pro. Now more than ever. It doesn't surprise me at all.

I said this a thousand times. The pro needs to charge for the labor and not the paper it ends up being printed on! So yes find the labor in photography and make that your business.

If it costs you 150 dollars to print 30 8x10 units. Charge a 750 session fee and give them 30 8x10's. If they don't want 30 8x10's charge 750 for 20. If they don't want 20 charge 750 for 10 8x10's. If they don't want 10, charge 750 just to pick up your camera. Everyone just needs to get with the program.

J T
  View Public Profile Send a private message to jtsmith Visit jtsmith's homepage! Find More Posts by jtsmith
 
Re: Kodak, Picture Kiosks, and Copyright
Old 12-19-2006, 02:54 AM   #3 (permalink)
Lifetime Photographer

 
RobArtLyn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Member GG#: 55042
Location: Alexandria
Posts: 415
Comments: 0
My Mood:

RobArtLyn is offline IP: 138.88.32.2
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtsmith View Post
If it costs you 150 dollars to print 30 8x10 units. Charge a 750 session fee and give them 30 8x10's. If they don't want 30 8x10's charge 750 for 20. If they don't want 20 charge 750 for 10 8x10's. If they don't want 10, charge 750 just to pick up your camera. Everyone just needs to get with the program.
Yes, yes, yes.

The world has changed. There is very little value offered to the client for making prints for them. The value is in conceiving, capturing and editing the image. Everything after that is becoming a commodity, if it hasn't already. Charge for the part of the process where you actually add value, and you won't miss out on providing commodity services.
  View Public Profile Send a private message to RobArtLyn Find More Posts by RobArtLyn
 
Re: Kodak, Picture Kiosks, and Copyright
Old 12-19-2006, 08:19 AM   #4 (permalink)
Free Member

 
gunstar34's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Member GG#: 54740
Location: Chester
Posts: 17
Comments: 0

gunstar34 is offline IP: 74.39.17.22
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

I was pretty proud of my local CVS the other day. I was out picking some items up as sombody was picking up there photos. When the employee realized that it was a prof. photo that was duplicated, they literally pulled the photo out of the customers hand and gave them a full refund. the customer argued with them and they refused to return the photo. I just smiled at the clerk and continued on.
__________________
When words become unclear, I shall focus with photographs. When images become inadequate, I shall be content with silence. ~Ansel Adams
  View Public Profile Send a private message to gunstar34 Visit gunstar34's homepage! Find More Posts by gunstar34
 
Re: Kodak, Picture Kiosks, and Copyright
Old 12-19-2006, 10:01 AM   #5 (permalink)
Ed Peters

 
epeters's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Member GG#: 37945
Location: Lafayette
Posts: 302
Comments: 0

epeters is offline IP: 65.193.202.162
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Welcome to the real world. I don't really see any difference in what Kodak is saying
and any other business (like cars that can do 150mph when the highest MPH limit
I have seen is 75). As I think somebody mentioned above, the way to handle it is to
charge for taking the image, and processing it. Not for making prints?? YMMV
__________________
Eat safe, use condiments.
  View Public Profile Send a private message to epeters Find More Posts by epeters
 
Re: Kodak, Picture Kiosks, and Copyright
Old 12-19-2006, 01:30 PM   #6 (permalink)
Lifetime Photographer

 
Mark_A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Member GG#: 35470
Location: Atlanta / Roswell, GA USA
Posts: 325
Comments: 0

Mark_A is offline IP: 65.6.134.149
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtsmith View Post
Kodak has always been interested in the consumer vs the pro. Now more than ever. It doesn't surprise me at all.

I said this a thousand times. The pro needs to charge for the labor and not the paper it ends up being printed on! So yes find the labor in photography and make that your business.

If it costs you 150 dollars to print 30 8x10 units. Charge a 750 session fee and give them 30 8x10's. If they don't want 30 8x10's charge 750 for 20. If they don't want 20 charge 750 for 10 8x10's. If they don't want 10, charge 750 just to pick up your camera. Everyone just needs to get with the program.

J T
What he said! Exactly.
  View Public Profile Send a private message to Mark_A Visit Mark_A's homepage! Find More Posts by Mark_A
 
Re: Kodak, Picture Kiosks, and Copyright
Old 12-19-2006, 09:30 PM   #7 (permalink)
Free Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Member GG#: 55251
Location: Seaside
Posts: 42
Comments: 0

jeffadamshti is offline IP: 12.210.11.33
 
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Bunch View Post
My full-time job is managing a 1-hr. photo lab for a major chain store. I recently attended a regional meeting during which a Kodak rep was touting the benefits of their newest kiosks, specifically the quality of the scanners and the accuracy of the software. The rep made SURE to remind all of us to remove any passwords which would limit the customer from completing the order themselves (previously in place to help prevent prank waste), and NOT to inspect any pictures being copied, or the actual copies made. It seems their legal dept. has determined that if the lab personnel are not aware that the customer is violating copyright, the lab is not liable - only the customer.

So Kodak actively produces and markets equipment which is capable of enabling consumers to violate copyright, but they also encourage lab personnel to turn a blind eye and do nothing to stop it. They prolly figured out that the main reason a person would want a photo copied is to copy a photo they didn't take in the first place.

The Moral? If you thought Kodak cared one whit about Pros you were naive, and if you're a Pro and you still depend on the print orders for the majority of your income, you better think seriously about shifting to a labor-based business type a.s.a.p.

David
Pricing - 10yrs ago in one of my workshops, during the biz portion, we all spoke of pricing strategies. I predicted that ayone charging a low "session" fee in hopes of large print sales later, would be transitioning to another career soon, and better learn to upsell french fries in a hurry.

Inclusive pricing is better for the client, they know what they will pay upfront, they know what they will get, no surprises. The more upscale the client the more they appreciate that. The lower end clients are used to the bait & switch of old, and figure ways to screw you instead of getting screwed.

J
__________________
----
Jeffrey Blake Adams
Fine Art - Fashion - Editorial
http://www.adamsphotographics.com
----
  View Public Profile Send a private message to jeffadamshti Visit jeffadamshti's homepage! Find More Posts by jeffadamshti
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Sponsors


New To Site? Need Help? Photographer & Model Links
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:31 PM.

© 1999-2017 Garage Glamour™




Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94