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Who's Your Daddy?
Old 07-03-2006, 11:39 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Ya know cracks me up? The whole daddy syndrome. I run into this all the time. What is with the older photographer "taking care" of the younger models he is around and playing the daddy role?

I am all for nice guys. I am all for people looking out for each other. I have nothing against age differences in dating. That is not what I am talking about. I am talking about the guy that starts the girls *** page for her, or Yahoo Club for her, then gets all upset when she no shows a shoot with him, or disappears from modeling as though he was just jilted by a girlfriend. "I did all of this work helping her out and now she just disappears". Here's a clue. You aren't her daddy and you aren't dating her and you most likely will never really get what you are trying to get from her. Stop denying that you want it. You are a guy. Of course you do! Even if you are getting as close as possible and hiding behind the whole daddy thing.

You know the guy I am talking about. The guy that hugs the girls, adjusts her underwear during a shoot and hangs in the dressing room when the girls are naked and says "It's ok. It's different with me. They know I am ok." Five minutes later the girl is coming to me and saying "He is so creepy. I mean he is nice and all, but why is he always touching me and hugging me? Does he HAVE to stay in the dressing room?" You aren't different. You are being used. Wise up. You are an old perv to them and they are just taking the presents...lol.

The girls are not innocent either. They take the clothes bought by the guy and they don't tell the guy that he is NOT their daddy so please stop "daddying" them. They don't tell them the guy he is grossing them out. For now though I am just cracking up over the "daddy". He is of course "just taking care of her" because he sees her "like a daughter." Dude, stop hanging out in your daughters dressing room, shooting her as naked as she will let you and hugging all over her. Don't say you are like a daddy and then say that she feels more comfortable shooting more naked with you because of it. that is pretty sick...lol.

I had a photographer recently tell me "I had 'the talk' with her about boyfriends" like I was going to agree that this young model should not have a boyfriend. Like it was somehow understood. She is young! It's the best time to have a boyfriend of he is supportive of her, and her dreams, goals and ambitions. Have fun and be young!

What happens is so obvious. The older photographer is getting as close as he can with the younger girl, but remains safely veiled behind the daddy role. It's as close to dating as he is ever going to get, but he still gets that thrill of staying just shy of rejection. He buys her things, takes care fo her, and "helps" her because it keeps him as close as possible. All the while he gets to say "It's ok sweetie. You are safe with me. I am different."

You want to be different? You want to make a girl feel safe, secure and ok with you? Get your ass out of the dressing room! Wait outside. She can show you the outfit before and after she is in it. Seeing her in the process of changing is not going to help you shoot her better. Stop hugging her and touching her with that level of intimacy. When she says it is ok it still isn't! She just wants more clothes! ;-) She is choking back the gag and accepting the gifts and everyone can see what is going on but the "daddy" doing the hugging.

Ok, that's enough for the soap box for the day. :-) Hope I didn't piss too many people off. I just think this is a funny subject. I feel much better now! :-)

Rick
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Better Yet....
Old 07-03-2006, 11:50 AM   #2 (permalink)
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...<b>leave the rose at home, and be a pro.</b>. They don't need saving, they need good, quality pictures. They don't come to a shoot seeking a boyfriend...that's what "dates" are for. <br>
I rarely know the personal life of any model. I don't make "donations" to any model. (don't you love model websites that ask for "donations"? I might try that....) When was the last time you heard a model say, "Yeah, he gave me great pictures but not that little Dolce and Gabbana number I was looking at....the <i>bastard.</i>" (Usually it's my wife who says that, and it's something from Marshall's or "Big Lots".) <br><br>I'm here to create great images as a pro. So-called photogs who cross that line (where the hell do they find the time for the drama) are really hiding behind the camera as to something that's been missing in their lives. And now have the attention of a pretty girl, even for the most fleeting of a moment, and pretend like "she's special." No, her boyfriend/husband is special....you're supposed to be a photographer. <br>
Hey, if you watch "the Girls Next Door" on E!, you'll see the sugar daddy relationship played out in full force. It works for both sides, God love 'em. (the shallowness is like watching a car crash...you just can't stop watching.) Hef doesn't ever say on the show, "No...this one is different." Hef isn't kidding himself...they make it clear that 24 is over the hill for the women he "dates". The problem here is that most of us aren't Hef (not me anyway). If Hef wasn't Hef, he'd be........us!
<br>
If you wanna chase young girls, cool...go for it. Just drop the act, and stop kidding yourself. And yes, for the guys-with-cameras that pull this junk (you know who you are), they do think you're a perv. Some will want nothing to do with you. Some will gladly take your "donations" until you figure out it's not going anywhere beyond the using-you factor. Oh yeah, they'll talk about ya, too. And yeah, to everybody. <br>
<img src="http://c.myspace.com/Groups/00007/61/31/7071316_l.gif" ><img src="http://www.dewa.com/animated/new3/a-camer.gif">
<i> ...but it's diffwent wiff me...!!</i>
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Last edited by postcardsfromthewasteland; 07-03-2006 at 12:38 PM..
 
Sugar Daddies are a Dime a Dozen
Old 07-03-2006, 12:05 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Hey Rick,

You do know this industry is about past middle aged guys who want to take pictures of their daughter's girl friends nude?

Regards, Art.
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Re: Who's Your Daddy?
Old 07-03-2006, 01:57 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I've known a few guys like this but the word gets around pretty quick and they soon wonder why models won't work with them. Duh? Most PEOPLE don't like being touched by strangers let alone models wearing intimate apparel.
When I invite other photographers over I let them know that the dressing room is off limits. That is their "safe place" away from everyone.
The hugging thing is a little different. There are different types of hugs just as there are different types of kissing. The "one arm cheek to cheek" hug is as friendly as the cheek to cheek kiss and quite different from the breast crushing intimate hug that I've seen given. I also believe that if a hug is to be given it must be initiated by the model.
View me as a professional, view me as an aquaintence or view me as a friend, but I aint nobodys daddy. I don't have the budget for it nor do I have the temperment for it.
I also have a wife with a jealous bone the size of a T-Rex.
Rick D.
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Re: Who's Your Daddy?
Old 07-03-2006, 02:52 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Photographers should always have a reference list of other photographers AND models that the model may contact. Everyone do their homework and everything should be well. Plus, if I was shooting a dude and his underware were crooked, I wouldn't be touching it! I can simply tell him. So, I would do the same with the female model.

And, to break the odds up a bit I'm not middle aged and seeing people naked isn't a big deal. If you want to see naked people, go look on the internet. If you want to see them live, go to a strip club. If you want a date, go to a dating service or bar or better yet maybe a church to get your mind out of the gutter. If you want to touch them, there are always prostitutes. If you want to create art with your camera you shouldn't mix any of the above with the process.

-joshua
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Why does everyone think they have the moral absolute on anything?
Old 07-03-2006, 03:42 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moscato_images
If you want to create art with your camera you shouldn't mix any of the above with the process.
Really?

You should tell that to Kern, Weston, Picasso, Ray, etc.... and many, many others.

Regards, Art.
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Last edited by Art; 07-03-2006 at 03:50 PM..
 
Re: Who's Your Daddy?
Old 07-03-2006, 03:54 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Hehe.. I know a couple of those down here! =)
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Re: Why does everyone think they have the moral absolute on anything?
Old 07-03-2006, 04:52 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art
Really?

You should tell that to Kern, Weston, Picasso, Ray, etc.... and many, many others.

Regards, Art.
...that they mixed their art with pleasure? I'm sure they were not really looking for dates and/or something to look at when they were doing their art. Maybe I'm wrong and the artists/photographers of this world are an underground society of male egotistical pig chauvinist who only look for way to satisfy their own pleasure by luring women whom they personally find attractive to their place for they can slowly dictate a photo shoot and call it work. *shrugs*

Art in itself should be the entity of pleasure during its creation.

...okay, I'm done writing my college philosophy term paper on art and its prevalence to the id's desire for pleasure.

-joshua
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Re: Who's Your Daddy?
Old 07-03-2006, 06:42 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dax
Hehe.. I know a couple of those down here! =)

Be nice Dax...
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Re: Who's Your Daddy?
Old 07-03-2006, 08:25 PM   #10 (permalink)
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What Rick said is nothing new, but the same message needs to be repeated over and over again and not necessarily on forums, but at every opportunity where group shooting occurs, workshops are the very good place to do this. Judging by the respondents to Rick's post one would think that he was preaching to the choir. I can accepted it specially when I remember seeing those occurances in the past. performed by very good photographers who don't see the line too clearly. For example, taking a break from shooting in the studio and having quick lunch in nearby restuarant as opposed to arranging for the evening dinner as if it was a formal date. One local guy told the model's escort/boyfriend he was not invited to the dinner, how sad it was to hear this comment. Rick keep hammering away and those of us who agree with you should echo it back because the message is right. Thanks.
John Osadzinski aka Photoshooter

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